Albert Edward Hutchinson - Mounted Infantry

[Bob.NB]

I have been carrying out some research into the military career of Albert Edward Hutchinson who served with the mounted infantry in the 2nd Battalion Manchester Regiment in the Boer War (wounded) and then with the 1st Battalion in WWI (POW).
I have made contact with some of his descendants (via Ancestry) and they have a photo of him on horseback wearing his Boer War medals (see photo). They  thought he had served in the cavalry but he spent much of his time with the mounted infantry (14th M I Regiment).
However I do not recognise the cap badge in the photograph - can anyone help me please.
Many thanks.
Bob B
 

[sphinx]

Bob,

If his service number is 5475 then his papers state he was in the 1st Bn in the Boer War,  also his "wound" was not in the line of duty.
I cannot find him on the QSA medal rolls for the 1st Bn, 2nd Bn or Manchester Regt MI men, so do you have his QSA/KSA to ascertain the naming and clasps as it might narrow it down a bit.

I do not recognise the cap badge and I know them all, maybe its the glare or angle.  The photo appers to be in his back yard so i doubt he is actually on a horse, hence the oval cropping.

His papers also show him KIA 21.12.1914.  I assume he was missing then POW according to your research.

Please tell us more.

regards

[mack]

the QSA+KSA medal rolls list him as 5475 j.hutchinson.

the info i have on 5475 albert,edward hutchinson,is that he was serving with the 2nd battalion in SA,then posted to the 1st batt on 20-2-1902,he was severly wounded on 3rd may 1901 while serving with general bullocks force.
clasps for QSA medal,wittenberg,transvaal and cape colony,KSA medal 1901+1902.

i dont know if they are the same man,both were awarded the same medals+clasps

i agree with simon,he probably wasnt sat on a horse,ive seen these type of photos before,whats puzzling is that albert was awarded two good conduct badges,but hes not wearing the GC stripes in the picture,and he was still in the army in 1914 because he re-engaged in october 1910 for a further 4yrs,so why is he wearing a strange cap badge,surly he would still have had his manchester badges

are the family sure this is albert

mack

[Bob.NB]

Thanks for these guys.
Attached is a photo of Albert on horseback.
The family say it is him but of course they may be wrong.
He was definitely in the 2nd Battalion in the Boer War - he is shown on the medal roll as 5475 Cpl J Hutchinson (just to confuse matters)- and served with the 14th Mounted Infantry.
After the Army reserve he was mobilised for WWI and joined the 1st Battalion in France before being taken POW on 21 Dec 1914 (at Givenchy I suppose). On 25 May 1915 his wife was informed officially that he had been KIA in December but two days later she received a postcard from him to say that he was a POW at the notorious Wittenbergen Camp. He returned to the UK in 1917, probably as part of a prisoner exchange. He died in 1954.
the research as always goes on.
Bob B

[sphinx]

Bob,

Well I was wrong!  Thats definately a horse.

Still dont know the badge.  Do you have his medals?

regards

[Robert Bonner]

Bob.
The 14th MI Battalion was originally mainly a Manchester unit.

Commanded by Captain Bridgford. No 2 Company consisted of men from 1st & 2nd Manchesters and 2nd Middlesex. Captain Brindley of 2nd Manchesters was wounded in the engagement at Holland on 19 December 1901, dying from his wounds the following day. 2069 Sergeant J Hall of 2nd Manchesters was awarded the DCM whist serving with the 14th Battalion and received the clasps ”Wittebergen”, “Transvaal” and “Cape Colony”.

5475 Corporal AE Hutchinson of 2nd Manchesters was wounded at Tweefontein on 4 May 1901 and received the same clasps. 4987. Lance Corporal J Rafter of 2nd Manchesters was killed in action at Boomje Alleen on 14 November 1901 and 5706 Private T Hall, also of 2nd Manchesters, was severely wounded in the same action. Private George Bradshaw of 1st Manchesters was slightly wounded in an action near Hendrinkspan on 15 December 1901.

[mack]

pte 5706 thomas,ward hall was a 20yr old labourer when he enlisted in the manchesters on 6th feb 1899,he lived at 336 liverpool rd,patricroft,he went to SA on 16th march 1900,he was shot in the neck+back at boomje alleen on 14th nov 1901,he was discharged as medically unfit on 4th november 1902,he went on to marry miss lilian,fanny cole at st.james church,hampshire and had three children,rita,maurice and winifred.
he re-enlisted in the 302nd MT coy ASC on 6-9-1915 and served throughout the war,eventually being demobbed in february 1919
resided at 10 peabody st,weaste

mack

[Bob.NB]

Thanks guys - yes I have his medals. Evidently his great grand-daughter took them to a swap shop in the 1960s. However family very happy to see that they are being appreciated and reseqrched by a collector.
Still no luck on the cap badge - could it be some form of Lancs Volunteer Regt?
Bob B

[sphinx]

Bob,

Its not any Lancashire VTC cap badge of WW1.

Seperating the badge, the top part looks like a Fusilier grenade and the lower part a Light Infantry bugle horn.  No badge of that description actually exists though.

I am wondering if he has just put something in his cap to pose a photo?

I just dont know.

regards

[Bob.NB]

Thank you for all your replies.
For some reason the family believe it may be a Sherwood Forresters badge as he came from Notts.
The family have also sent me a copy of Albert Edward's 21 page diary of his time from capture at Givenchy and whilst in POW camp until his release, so I will send a copy to the Manchester Regiment Archives so that everyone can read it - it makes fascinating reading.
Bob B

[mack]

hiya bob.
can we have a copy for our forum please.

mack

[Bob.NB]

Mack,
Certainly but it is 21 pages long.
How do I do that?
Bob

[mack]

Mack,
Certainly but it is 21 pages long.
How do I do that?
Bob

oh heck.
ime not clued up on how to send images bob,and 21 pages is a lot

mack

[Bob.NB]

Guys,
I've been continuing my research into Pte Albert Edward Hutchinson and the recent release of the IRC PoW records has raised another question.
Pte Hutchinson was severely wounded and captured at Givenchy on 21 December 1914 and transported to Wittenberg PoW camp in Germany where he remained for almost 18 months.
On 29 May 1916 he was transferred to Switzerland with other badly wounded British troops and taken to Chateaux d'Oex.
He remained in Switzerland for over a year and had an operation on his wounded arm. He was not returned to the UK until 15 September 1917.
My questions are as follows:
1) His PoW index card states that he was "Interned at Chateaux d'Oex" - were these PoWs still under some form of obligation once they had been sent to Switzerland (I guess as part of a prisoner exchange)?
2) Is the time it took Hutchinson to be returned to the UK from Switzerland (15 months) normal - it seems an awfully long time to me!
Any advice most gratefully received as always.
Many thanks.
Bob B