The Manchester Regiment Forum

The Boer War => 1899 - 1902 => Topic started by: M/CP2 on January 19, 2015, 02:47:39 AM

Title: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on January 19, 2015, 02:47:39 AM
I have a Militia Attestation for the John Henry Blakeley, 5th Manchester Regiment, Registration No. 7363 or 7343. It is dated 27th December 1900 and he is living at 39 Carver Street, his family and home address. Age is 18 years and 8 months. On the statement of services it states he was attested Manchester Regiment on 19 March 1901 and the it reads like WO& 49 Days. He was a single man and his d.o. b. is 26 April 1882.
I assume that this means after his Militia Training with the 5th Regiment he was transferred to the Regular Army Manchester Regiment?
He was not present on the 1901 Census with his family but I found him on the 1901, with the 4th Regiment of the Manchester Regiment at Portland Dorset, John Blakeley age 18, Soldier, Born Manchester.
I read on the Forum, that the 4th Regiment was training soldiers for other Manchester Regiments as replacements, but although I have checked all available sites I cannot find him in the Regiment. There are several J, Blakeley's but not in the Manchester's and the one and only J.H. that I could find has been discounted. Does anyone know if the 4th Regiment placed their recruits in Regiments other than the Manchester's?
I would appreciate any help or advice, as I do believe that this John Henry Blakeley, is the same one as the John Henry Blakeley in WW1, WO 2 CSM 16 Battalion. No. 985. He later transferred to the Labour Corps CSM, but his medals were earned during service with this Battalion. I have his Medal Rolls, Medal Card but no other personal details apart from the photos. I know he was still alive in 1908, but I could not find him on the 1911 Census.
Thank you if you can help me in any way .
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: mack on January 19, 2015, 05:31:01 AM
the 985 number isn't a service number,it was his ticket number when he enlisted in the 16th manchesters in 1914,his correct 16th battalion number was 6574,he was originally the CSM of D.coy but replaced by CSM Thomas dewan,and CSM blakeley took over as CSM of E.coy.

mack ;D
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: sphinx on January 19, 2015, 11:33:20 AM
In 1900 the Manchester Regiment doubled its regular Battalions to 4.
Therefore your man in the 4th Bn was a Regular soldier.

They were a draft producing unit and from July 1901 wewre basded County Cork, Ireland.

The drafts would be for the other Regular Battalions of the Manchester Regiment only.

Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on January 20, 2015, 02:11:23 AM
Dear Mack and Sphinx

Thank you both so much for your replies. I see now that he would have probably gone to SA shortly after the census so that was really helpful Sphinx I just need to probe around a bit more.

Thank you too Mack too about the numbers, how confusing! It makes no mention of that no. on either the Medal Rolls or the Medal Card. But I did find an entry for another John Blakeley in the Salford AVR with that No. i.e.

Absent Voter: 1918 North Division, Salford, Lancs.
John Blakeley -
Qualifying Premises: 6 Withington Street
Polling District: N.K.
Description of Service: 6574 Pte., 16th Manchesters
Register: Absent Voters List 1918, Entry 3389
Source: Lancashire Parish Clerk
Strangely though I could not find a Medal Card at the NA for this man.

If I have got the right man JH Blakeley lived in Chorlton and Manchester so could possibly be on the AVR. I do have an address for his mother in 1918 in Withington. But he may have been married by then so that is why I did not go along that road as I have no evidence. He has been hard to trace him really since 1908 when he was a witness to his sister's wedding.

Thank you again to both of you for your helpful advice.
Kindest regards,
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: Wendi on January 20, 2015, 11:15:43 AM
Hi Pat

If there is no medal card for this man, it would indicate that he did not go overseas during the war.

Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on January 21, 2015, 01:59:54 AM
Dear Wendi,
Thank you for the advice re John Blakleley No. 2. Much appreciated,
Kind regards,
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: mack on January 21, 2015, 10:00:32 AM
in 1914 he lived at 3 regent ave,moss side

mack ;D
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on January 22, 2015, 04:28:40 AM
Dear Mack

Thank you so much Mack, you know I originally thought this would be an easy man to knock off if you know what I mean! Here I appear to now have two of them?
Would you think it pretty dense of me if I asked you which one you are referring to? That is if you know, I know how difficult it is without service papers but I am hoping that the information from the Forum so far will help me to build a better picture.
The family lived in the Chorlton area for years and I know Moss Side was not too far away. I will check what I have and see if I can pin down the address in Moss Side. Thank you again Mack.

Kindest regards,
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: Pete Th on January 24, 2015, 08:19:03 AM
Ben, a member of the SWARM forum, sent me the following information:

1891 at 39 Carver street C-of-M
John Blakeley 34 Tin plate worker
Emma Blakeley 30
John H Blakeley 8
Leah Blakeley 6
Fred Blakeley 3
Joseph Blakeley 1

At same addres for 1901 but son John Herny now in the army( Miss spelling on census)
John Blakley 43
Enna Blakley 40
Leah Blakley 17
Fred Blakley 14
Jos Blakley 12
Florence Blakley 9

1910 father John Blackley died & buried in Southern cemetery, C-of-E section, grave number: L-2273
Buried on 1st Dec 1910
Abode: 105 Hr Cambridge St C-On-M

Leah Blakeley married Edward Daly 1908 at All Saints,C-On-M
Brother John Henry is witness

1911 at 105 Hr Cambridge St C-On-M
Emma Blakeley 50
Fred Blakeley 23
Joseph Blakeley 21
Florence Blakeley 19

1913 directory Emma Blakeley at 105 Hr Cambridge St C-On-M , Householder

1916 Fred married Annie Louise Thomas.

1918 absent voters register for C-On-M
34 Rose street, C-On-M
Blakeley Fred - 377472 Pte., 1/10 Manchester Regiment

Also buried in the Southern cemetery grave:
Emma Blkeley - widow
Age: 91
Abode: 91 Parsonage Road, Withington

Joseph Blackeley - Soap maker
Age: 66
Abode: 61 Edgerton road, Chorlton-cum-Hardy.

Baptism: 28 May 1882 St Mark, Hulme, Lancashire, England
John Henry Blakeley - Child of John Blakeley & Emma
Born: 26 Apr 1882
Abode: 20 Edge St.
Occupation: Tinplate worker
Baptised by: T. H. Guest Rector

1933 Directory has a Mrs E Blackleye at 56 Mosslane West - shopkeeper

John Henry Blakeley died 28the Sept 1939

Probate record:
Blakeley john Henry of 56 Moss lane west, Manchester 16 died 28the Sept 1939
Administrator (with will) Manchester 26th Oct to Eileen Blakeley widow.
Effects: £185-16s-9d.

John Henry Blakeley buried in Southern cemetery.
Grave number: i-1107

Now did he marry in a R.C church & Was Eileen Catholic?
Can not at the moment find a marriage John Henry Blakeley to an Eileen?

Eilenn Blakeley nee Abrhams went on to marry a Thomas John Thomas 1940 Manchester Register Office or Registrar Attended

Hope this helps
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on January 25, 2015, 03:34:22 AM
That was amazing took me years to discover all that!
Fred died in Action, King's Liverpool Regiment was formerly Manchester Reg. 5623. 4 September 1918. This too was most likely renumbered as the AVR you gave me for Fred is the same one on his Memorial.

Joseph was in the RAF He was a Clerk and a Sgt.

I would like to think that John Henry Blakeley is the one I have listed here in previous posts. I definitely have his attestation giving Carver Street in 1900 and 1901 in the Census for the 4th Reg.
My thinking is that he would hardly go straight into the Manchester Reg. in 1914 without previous service to be recognised for CSM. I was just looking for something that would confirm I have the right man, an address or something like that. Mack gave me Regent Ave, Moss Side, but he was not there in 1929
I looked at the service numbers that were superseded for 985 and it did not include that number 6574. I am not saying that this is incorrect or belongs to another John I simply do not know enough. So, at this point I decided to just forget about this confusion and see if I could find other evidence. But no. I checked Kelly's 1929 almost from cover to cover! I was just about to check for other years using other family addresses when I read your reply. So I will continue with renewed hope. Thank you so very much and to your contact too, its so much appreciated.
I do not know really if Eileen was his wife or not I could not find a marriage, also I could not find him on the 1911. There is however no doubt that there was a John Henry Blakeley who died in 1939 for the right age and who had become a Catholic possibly.
If I do have his photo right the one lying down in the NCO's he looks the right age for 1882. There is something about the ears that tells me.
Thank you so much again,
Kindest regards,
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on February 01, 2015, 11:04:23 PM
Dear Pete and Sphinx and Mack and Wendy
I had an incredible lead from your contact that led to me more information on JHB and linked me to Cork again. He married there and I later found them in the 1911 Census at the Military Barracks in Westmeath!
I just thought I would let you know that seemingly small details have played a big part in searching for my soldier and I am very grateful to you all.
I have identified him in respect of his Military Service, and now I have the references to hopefully connect his record to his family . Pity about his medals though, he probably wore them with pride for his ribbons to become tattered, I hope so.
Kind regards,
Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: sphinx on February 01, 2015, 11:17:44 PM

What medals of his do you have?

Title: Re: BOER WAR John Henry Blakeley
Post by: M/CP2 on February 02, 2015, 04:58:04 AM
Dear Sphinx

Sorry to  mislead you I do not have any and if I did I would donate them to the Manchester Regiment Museum! I read on the forum that his medals were up for sale on Ebay and that the ribbons were tatty. But the message was about 6 years ago. They are inscribed with his No. as 985. 1915 Star and the British and Victory Medal as well as his name.
He married at Cork in 1905, which fits in with what you said. but I do not know if he actually served in the Boer War. In the 1911 Irish Census his Regimental no. is 6649 and he is a sgt. married with no children. Unfortunately his Regiment is not named. He must have been home on leave in 1908 when he was a witness to his sister's wedding. He would have been in the Regular Army 10 years to 1911.

Looking at his medal rolls I think he may have had a rotten time in France. I cannot see that he was awarded the Silver WB. But there may have been a good reason to transfer him to the Labour Corps at some later stage in the war with the same ranking. He was only about 34 in 1916.
Kind regards,