Captain Henry Edward Braine

[Tim Bell]

Hi All,
I had a bit of a wander this morning and took a photo of the inscription for Capt Braine on the Brookwood Memorial - no known grave in 2nd World War.  I passed the pic. to Tonyrod and thought a little background on this man may be interesting.

Henry was commissioned as 2/Lt in Manchesters on 18/10/15 and entered France on 8/11/15.  The Cotton Town Comrades appears to make reference to him, indicating he served in the 24th Oldham Battalion.  Henry retired in 1919 as a Lt.

He seems to have been to Canada and New York before his wedding in 1930.  He then served in WW2 with 11th Battalion.  He died at sea on 1-2/6/1943 as Captain in the Regiment with the RA notation - aged 46.  He had been born and resident in Essex.  His widow lived in Somerset.

I've been pretty blinkered with my research (17th in WW1) and assume there are numerous examples of men that served in both wars.  I suspect this is the only officer to have no known grave in WW2 who also served in WW1.

Any further information would be appreciated.

Tim

[Tim Bell]

It seems there may be a number of examples of Officers from the Regiment who also served in WW2.  Prior to Mark Hone's reminder, here's an example of a former 17th Bttn Officer.  Sorry I didn't take a pic. for you.  If you need one, I can go back in a month or so.  Tony now has some photos of the Memorial.

CARTMAN, THOMAS

Rank:
    Lieutenant
Trade:
    & Qmr
Service No:
    98219
Date of Death:
    02/07/1940
Age:
    47
Regiment/Service:
    General List
Awards:
    M C
Panel Reference
    Panel 21. Column 3.
Memorial
    BROOKWOOD MEMORIAL

Additional Information:

Son of Thomas and Ann Cartman; husband of Alice Cartman, of Whitefield, Lancashire.

[Wendi]

I suspect this is the only officer to have no known grave in WW2 who also served in WW1.

Tim

What makes you suspect that Tim?

Wendi

[Tim Bell]

Hi Wendi,
Henry is the only Officer on this Memorial who served with the Manchester Regiment in both world wars.  As this is the 'main' memorial for the Army relating to men with no known grave in the 2nd War, I doubt there are many / any more.  

Thomas Cartman served with the Regiment in WW1, but not 2nd.  I wish I'd taken a pic. of his inscription though.

Tim

[mack]

this memorial is for men and women from Britain and the commonwealth from all arms of service whos graves or place of death has never been establishedits ,similar to the WW1 memorial.its not the main army memorial,there are memorials all over the world commemorating men and women who have no known grave,who died in thoose specific theatres of war,two examples are the Athens and Singapore memorials

mack

[Wendi]

  I thought that was a rather sweeping statement Tim !

From CWGC website

The BROOKWOOD MEMORIAL commemorates nearly 3,500 men and women of the land forces of the Commonwealth who died during the Second World War and have no known grave, the circumstances of their death being such that they could not appropriately be commemorated on any of the campaign memorials in the various theatres of war. They died in the campaign in Norway in 1940, or in the various raids on enemy occupied territory in Europe such as Dieppe and St Nazaire. Others were special agents who died as prisoners or while working with Allied underground movements. Some died at sea, in hospital ships and troop transports, in waters not associated with the major campaigns, and a few were killed in flying accidents or in aerial combat.

Which then also explains why some brave souls who died in the British Isles have no known grave. Interesting.

I had not heard of this Memorial, so Thanks Tim!

Wendi

[Tim Bell]

Wendi,

It seems I over-egged the pudding, but Henry and the Memorial still capture the imagination.  I've searched lost ships for the date of death and can't see anything relevant.  Edward may not be an exception, but it is a bit of a mystery what happened to him.  He is also commemorated at the Cannington War Memorial in Somerset.  Does anyone know where the 11th Battalion were on 1/6/43?  Does the RA designation mean Manchester Regiment Royal Artillery?
T