Author Topic: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany  (Read 8863 times)

Offline themonsstar

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Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« on: May 05, 2010, 10:35:43 AM »
I was looking at the magazine "The Queue" a monthly mag published by the PoW Officers in Mainz PoW camp. The one I was looking at covers August-September 1918. It gives a list of Officers of all units here are the ones for the Manch Regt;


Capt Gibbons W. Block 1, from Stockport.
Lt Griffith W.H.E.N. Block 1, from Barmouth.
Lt Haslam C. Block 3, from Beechfield.
2/Lt Hayes F. Block 3, from Manchester.
2/Lt Hayes T.M. MC. Block 1, Manchester.
2/Lt Hillian J. Block 2, from Tollcross,Glasgow.
2/Lt Holland RP. Block 3, from Davenport.
2/Lt Johnstone VH. Block 1, from Saltburn.
2/Lt Jones E. Block 2, from Birkenhead.
Lt Keys S. Block 1, from Manchester.
Lt Makinson H. Block 3, from Leigh.
2/Lt Marshall CT. Block 3, Gorton,Manchester.
Lt Porter RP. Block 3, from Cockerham.
2/Lt Parsons G. Block 3, from Manchester.
Capt Rathbone L. Block 2, from Manchester.
2/Lt Ringham HT. Block 2, from Stockport.


The lists were published mouthly in this PoW magazine. So if anyone has any of the PoW magazines of Manchester Regiment PoWs  in them can you publish them.


Offline mack

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2013, 03:46:22 AM »
2/Lt h.t ringham. 26th june 1918
next month our magazine THE QUEUE starts,rather a good name considering the amount of queueing we do.

mack ;D

Offline mack

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2013, 01:22:24 PM »
2/Lt ringham. 26th july 1918
the queue magazine came out today,its rather good

manchester officers not in the list,who are in this camp
2/Lt e.bradwell.16th batt
2/Lt f.s shaw.16th batt
2/Lt a.woodacre.16th batt
2/Lt s.w cannon.17th batt
capt w.g woodward.17th batt

Offline mack

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2013, 05:47:39 PM »
t.m hayes should be j.m hayes.2/Lt james.milton hayes was the famous actor,author and poet,according to the internet,very little is known about his life,they think he may have come from lancashire.

2/Lt james,milton hayes.
7th manchesters
taken prisoner 21-3-18,POW at mainz
repatriated 5-12-18
MC
son of james,william+amy hayes,7 hyde grove,chorlton on medlock
born 1884 at 12 union st,ardwick[near ardwick barracks]
baptised at st.silas church,ardwick on 28-9-1884
became a insurance clerk after leaving school
member of the eccentric club,9 ryder st,london
died in france on 16th december 1940
resided at 16 avenue des beaumettes,nice,alpes maritimes

during his time at mainz,he put on many plays and sketches for the officers,he was in the same block as alec waugh,older brother of evelyn waugh
« Last Edit: April 01, 2013, 05:49:30 PM by mack »

Offline sphinx

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2013, 05:50:16 PM »
"resided at 16 avenue des beaumettes,nice,alpes martimes"

Is that in Ardwick mack ;D

Offline mack

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2013, 06:26:57 PM »
i think so simon ;D ;D ;D

mack ;D

Offline Robert Bonner

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2013, 02:54:21 PM »
J Milton Hayes
Born and lived with his parents at 7 Hyde Grove, Ardwick – then a select professional neighbourhood. Author of ‘Cling of the Clay’ about Ardwick and Manchester. (A copy in Manchester Central Library).He composed ‘The Green Eye’ in less than five hours at Hyde Grove. He worked initially as a pupil teacher at Ross Place Board School, and then went into insurance. Decided he should become an actor and as a young man acted with Sybil Thorndyke and Lewis Casson.

Served in 7th Manchesters. In March 1918 attached to the Anzac Division at Passchendaele as Traffic Officer where he was awarded the Military Cross. Later as Captain, captured and taken to Rastatt Camp then to Mainz fortress.  He died at Nice in December 1940.   Also wrote Orange Peel and Orders.

Robert

ebe-marshall4964

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2013, 06:23:22 PM »
Hi, new on the forum.  My grandfather was Cornelius Theobald Marshall, listed here as "2/Lt Marshall CT. Block 3, Gorton,Manchester".  I am trying to track his movements through the war but not doing too well - he joined up with the 30th Battalion (Reserves) Royal Fusiliers, April 1916, and then seemed to serve in different battalions, ending in 17th and/or 19th Manchesters.  What we do know is that he was captured at St Eloi, Ypres, April 1918 and held in Mainz Citadel until the end of the war. 

Have attempted to attach a picture of him and fellow prisoners - anyone recognise anybody?  CT Marshall is seated on the left of the bench. Have some further pictures if anyone interested...

Offline themonsstar

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2013, 08:32:21 AM »
Hi Ebe

Welcome to the site, If you have more pictures it would be great if you posted them on here, are they of him as a PoW in the camp or with his battalion.


Cheers Roy

ebe-marshall4964

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2013, 03:17:22 PM »
Hi Roy,

Afraid only have POW ones (attached) and a few portraits of him in his uniform, none with the rest of his battalion.  Wondered if anyone who had the list of inmates at Mainz could tie the names in with the handwriting on the previous photo: McCoy, Holland, ?-Walters???  Or recognise anyone in the pictures, or their uniforms. Anyway, maybe interesting to someone... 
 
Not sure if this is also of interest nor if I should put this somewhere else on the forum, but this is his account of his capture 26.4.18, St Eloi, Ypres - think this transcribes it:

“D Coy. of 17th Battn The Manchester Regt was left flank Coy., Coy. left flank being THE BLUFF - a strongpoint.  15 Platoon was about 500 yds to R. of L. Flank and S.W. of it.

The Coy. held the line for 10 days and was relieved by a Coy. of a Composite Battalion of Sussex & Gloucester Regts., D. Coy. of 17th Man/ters being held in Bde. Reserve.

Next morning 25/4/18 we heard that our old location was lost and D. Coy. was obliged to attack alone to retake it; we set out to counter attack at 2 p.m., advancing we suffered a number of casualties but reached a trench in our front in which were a number of the Composite Battalion.  We reinforced them and our senior off. present sent back information .  We had no artillery or M.O. support whatever.

Early on morning of 26/4/18 15 platoon (commanded by me) was moved to a disconnected trench further R. getting into pos. at about 4.30 AM in the trench 1 officer and about 15 men of Compos. Batt.

About 150 yds. on my R. was SHELLEY FARM, which we were told was held by us - we sent out several connecting patrols which failed to return.

It was very misty and daylight coming, the mist lifted a little we saw the enemy in small hos. doubling to our rear on R. of SHELLEY FARM; Runners sent by me to D.Coy. C.H.2 or B.H.2. failed to return; we used L.Gs. with good effect, but saw larger parties of enemy in our immediate rear and fired on them; our own 18 pdrs. opened fire on us, inflicting casualties.

Notwithstanding our efforts enemy closed in from R. Flank, Rear and a large number of our own men previously captured were made to walk in front of the enemy who thus closed in on the front.  I was captured with about 10 of my platoon at 6 p.m. 26/4/18.

C.T. Marshall
D Coy
19th Battln. The Manchester Regt.



(Interesting early German use of human shields, I thought.)
Also have a typed transcription of the 17th Battalion's war diary covering the same event - not sure of its accuracy as don't know where it is from originally:


17 MANCHESTERS ....BATTALION WAR DIARY

25 April 1918.  Spoil Bank near St. Eloi.

Enemy attacked and forced back the battalion south of the Ypres-Comines canal.  C and D companies (made into a composite company), counter-attacked and restored the situation on the front.  2 Lt D. Budenberg killed whilst gallantly leading the attack.  A and B companies (composite), under 2 Lt F. Ruddy D.C.M. together with a company of the 16 Manchesters formed successfully a defensive flank and enabled the Btn to maintain position.

26 April

In a thick mist the enemy broke through the line held by Btn on left and enveloped C and D companies.  No officer or men with these companies has returned.  The remnants of the Btn were withdrawn after hard fighting to the north bank of the canal (lock 8) suffering heavy casualties during the withdrawal.  A line was formed near Lock 8 and held.  The remnant of the Btn remained in the line during a further 2 days battle.

29 April

Btn relieved and withdrawn to Scottish Camp

CASUALTIES

Officers killed   Budenberg and Leybourne

Officers missing   2 Lts Rathbone, C.T. Marshall, L.H. Smith, S.W. Cannon, J. Hillian, J.A. Woollen, H.T. Prentis, G. Leach

plus 212 other rank casualties.


Good website and forum!

Ebeth.




Offline mack

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2013, 03:25:04 AM »
hiya ebeth.
the names of your officers are

seated right.2/Lt aubrey,john cuming-walters,21 egerton rd,chorlton cum hardy,aged 24,died 1975 in manchester,captured 10-4-18,cheshire regt attatched from south lancs regt

seated middle,Lt k.mudie,7th lancashire fusiliers,captured 21-3-18,repatriated 2-12-18

standing right.2/Lt robert,pembrey holland,"whitemere"davenport,stockport,died 27-6-1946 at macclesfield general hospital,born 1889,resided braeside cottage,mottram saint andrews when he died,he was in the same block as your grandfather[block 3]captured 24-3-18,6th manchesters,married flora dunlop hughes at dunham massey 19-3-1913,repatriated 29-11-18.

there was no officer called mccoy who was taken prisoner.

strange how your grandfather still referred to himself as 19th manchesters,he was with the 17th battalion when he was taken prisoner,repatriated 2-12-18

mack ;D
« Last Edit: December 11, 2013, 03:26:45 AM by mack »

Offline mack

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2013, 04:02:19 AM »
i,me fairly sure the fourth mans name is hay,and he looks like hes wearing an RAF uniform,there were two men captured from the RAF,Lt j.hay,but he wouldnt have been in this picture,he was sent to holland on 19-4-18,then there was capt j.b.h hay,captured 22-8-18.

mack ;D

ebe-marshall4964

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2013, 11:34:23 AM »
Mack, that is brilliant information, thanks loads.  Yes, I struggled with the writing but 'Hay' would fit.

Also, agree it is odd about signing that he attached to the 19th when other information points to the 17th - don't think I'm misreading that.  I'm not sure how the men from reserve battalions were used.  I can't clearly see from my grandfather's service record which battalions he was attached to - seems to go from Royal Fusiliers Reserves 30th to 8th to 24th but no mention of Manchesters until get to his capture.

Cheers, though, with identifying the guys in the photo.  I will ask my mother if she knew if he stayed in contact with any of them - I suspect not, would rather forget the whole unpleasant business!

Ebeth

ebe-marshall4964

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2014, 03:56:03 PM »
A while since I found my grandfather's name in themonstar's kind sharing of names from The Queue magazine.  Subsequently, I found an earlier copy of the magazine from July 1918 on eBay - it has the names of prisoners, surnames A-F.  Ones from the Manchesters are:

Rank.    Name.                 Block.  Home Address

Lt.         Atkin, H.D.         1.        Broadstairs
2/Lt.      Baggs, H.            3.        Manchester
".          Bentley, J.A.        3.        Castleton, Manchester
".          Benson, F.C.        1.        Wisbech
".          Bradley, F.           3.        Manchester
".          Bradwell, E.         3.        Sheffield
".          Cannon, S.W.       2.       Cambridge
".          Dyer, A.B.C.         3.       Walthamstow
Capt.     Ellis, S.R.             1.       Wigan
2/Lt.      Freeman, F.P.      1.       Tunbridge Wells

Hope I've transcribed that OK and it might be interesting for you guys  :)

Offline Wendi

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Re: Manchester Regt Officers in the Citadel Mainz Germany
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2014, 08:34:39 AM »
Thanks Ebeth, we ae always interested!

Amasing what can be found on ebay.

Wendi
"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it!  No matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and with your own common sense" ~ Buddha