Author Topic: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg  (Read 8201 times)

Offline tobo

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Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« on: January 26, 2009, 07:39:04 PM »
There are 12 attachments with this, if nothing else please have a read of Mr Lanes letter and the 'holiday' broadcast.

Arthurs wife Frances died in 1988 never knowing the fate of her first husband. All she ever got was notification in 1943 or'44 that Arthur was a prisoner of the Japanese. For many years after the war she attended numerous meetings and gatherings in the Manchester area in a forlorn attempt to learn something of her husband but got nowhere. The document in pic 9 probably explains why she learned nothing from returned P.O.W.'s, but why nothing from the war department?. Frances lived in the house noted in Arthurs statement of service until 1969/70, so the excuse of a house move isnt viable. Eventually she gave up her quest and re-married in 1955.
In 1998 I 'found' Arthur and began researching him, the Manchester Regiment
Museum very kindly put me in touch with Mr Arthur Lane who actually served
with my uncle and who gave me some superb information.The icing on the cake came courtesy of the British Embassy in Burma who laid a poppy wreath on
Arthurs grave. The final act was to ask the War Graves Commission if they had any next of kin info on Arthur, they said no because the army didnt give them any, but I was told that he was originally buried in 32/34, block A, Sonkrai cemetery and was re-interred in Thanbyuzayat cemetery in December 1945.At this point i ended the research and put Frances lack of information down to a tragic clerical error.
Then recently I half remembered Arthur Lane saying something about a cover up of Far East P.O.W. deaths, so I revisited the Thanbyuzayat cemetery register
and from 3530481 Geoffrey Amos Allison to 3525986 Harold Townley found 75 1st Battalion Manchester regiment men who all(but 2) died in 1943 with no next of kin details. Are they clerical errors? am I just being suspicious? anybody got any answers?


 

Offline tobo

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2009, 07:42:33 PM »
Via Mr Arthur Lane

Offline tobo

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2009, 07:47:02 PM »
Order to returning P.O.W.s and the 75 men with no next of kin details
name-age-rank/number-date of death

Offline rafboy

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2009, 10:22:44 PM »
This is great Tony.  I have a photo of his POW Record Card thanks to Roy (themonsstar).  It is confirmed as his by his mothers name and the address, both are on the record card.  I will try to get a translation of the Japanese on it for you.  Let me know if you would like me to post it here or send it direct to you to post if you want to.  Using the photo of him I will try to find him in one of the two POW Group photos I have, copies are in the Far East Photo section of the Forum.
Cliff
Cliff P Son of 3525679 Sgt Arthur Phillips 1st Bn Manchester Regiment and RAPC

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2009, 04:36:47 PM »
Lads i would be very gratefull for the record! its fine to post it on here, will have a decco at the P.O.W. pix. Big thanx from aunties also.
tony

liverpool annie

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2009, 04:50:37 PM »


Oh Tony !

I have a lump in my throat  ..... would you allow me to post him on the Honour Roll ?

I'd be honoured to do so !

Annie

Offline rafboy

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2009, 05:14:21 PM »
Hi Tony
Arthur's POW Record Card is below.
If you have not seen it have a look at http://www.roll-of-honour.org.uk/  Go to Regiments, Manchester's and you will find Arthur's entry, also have a look at the cemeteries page and Thanbyuzayat.  I will post the site plan for all to see, Arthur is in plot B6.F6.
Cliff P Son of 3525679 Sgt Arthur Phillips 1st Bn Manchester Regiment and RAPC

Offline rafboy

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2009, 05:23:52 PM »
Tony
Thanbyuzayat Cemetery Plan is below.
I noticed that Arthur's date of birth is recorded on the POW card as 11 June 13  not as the MOD letter has him 11 June 11.  Arthur Lane's list of 75 has him as 31 which fits with the MOD Letter birth date.
Hope this helps.
Cliff 
« Last Edit: January 28, 2009, 10:08:22 PM by rafboy »
Cliff P Son of 3525679 Sgt Arthur Phillips 1st Bn Manchester Regiment and RAPC

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2009, 03:56:52 PM »
Cliff,                                                                                                        Many thanks mate, seeing the records has stirred lot of emotion from auntie who remembers Arthur. Noticed your Dads details, hope I aint caused you any upset by putting the posting on.
as always am dashing, but am going to follow up on the links you gave.

Annie,
You can put the pix on your roll of honour with pleasure, we are chuffed that your doing it!
ttfn
tony and tearfull auntie

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2009, 04:25:25 PM »
Cliff
       the card gives 45 clay st as an address, this was my grans house till 1975.
who would have given the japs this address?  bit of family confusion!
tony

Offline rafboy

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2009, 04:54:02 PM »
Tony
The address could only have been given by Arthur as the cards were the Japanese record of their prisoner.
No problem about my father, he was one of the few very lucky ones to survive and go on to have a a long life.
I am just sending the Record Card photo off to see if I can get a translation for you.
Cliff
Cliff P Son of 3525679 Sgt Arthur Phillips 1st Bn Manchester Regiment and RAPC

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2009, 07:00:31 PM »
Hi Cliff,
Glad about your father. Think we sussed out about the address. Ta for what you and Roy have done.
tony

Offline rafboy

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2009, 05:09:06 PM »
Tony
Second attempt to post this, got confused and went back to check on something and lost what I had written.
Below is a brief translation of Arthur Barber's POW Record Card.  My best translation source has been made redundant and has lost her contact in what was her Japanese parent company so this is not as detailed as I would have liked.
The Japanese on the card tells us that Arthur was transfered from Singapore to Thailand/Burma on 25th April 1943, this fits in with him going with "F" Force (See:http://www.cofepow.org.uk/pages/asia_thailand6.htm ). He died in Camp No 4 Sub Branch No 2 at 09:45 on 28th May 1943.  Camp No 4 was Songkurai which had two POW camps there.  I believe that Songkurai was also known as Songkuri and San Krai, there was a lot of confusion over camp names due to individuals understanding of the Japanese pronunciation of the camp names.
You will see on the back of the POW card the dates 18.4.25, this is 25th April 1943 and 18.5.28 this is 28th May 1943.  The Japanese based events from the date of the Emperor's Enthronement in this case Hirohito also known as Showa ( See the date convertor at: http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2272.html ).  Most of the cards I have looked at also have the date of capture on them as 17.2.15 which is 15th February 1942 but it is not on Arthur's.

Have you had chance to compare Arthur's photo to the two POW Group photos yet?  I am trying to identify as many of the men in them as I can, so far all identified have been Manchester's.
Cliff
Cliff P Son of 3525679 Sgt Arthur Phillips 1st Bn Manchester Regiment and RAPC

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2009, 08:46:10 PM »
hi Cliff
appreciate the translation, CWGC have given me San Krai. not had time to see pix yet!
tony

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Re: Drummer 3523637 Arthur Barber 1st Bttn Mcr Reg
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2009, 01:45:33 PM »
Hi Tony
Have you had chance to look at the group photos yet?
I will send my choice for Arthur direct to you.
Cliff
Cliff P Son of 3525679 Sgt Arthur Phillips 1st Bn Manchester Regiment and RAPC