Author Topic: Cap badge change from coat of arms to fleur de lys  (Read 11218 times)

daggers

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Cap badge change from coat of arms to fleur de lys
« on: October 06, 2008, 01:38:31 PM »
This may be an old query, but new to me. Why did the regiment's badge change [and was it in the 1920s?].
Daggers

Offline harribobs

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Re: Cap badge change from coat of arms to fleur de lys
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2008, 10:28:13 PM »
from themonsstar

FLEUR DE LYS
COPY OF APPLICATION FROM THE OFFICER COMMANDING Ist BATTALION ON BEHALF OF ALL BATTALIONS THE MANCHESTER REGIMENT.
No. I08/E/2I0/2.
2/11/1922.
From : The Officer Commanding, 1st Battalion The Manchester Regiment.
To : Headquarters, 24th (P) Infantry Brigade, Dublin.
DUBLIN,
SIR, 2nd November, 1922.
I have the honour to re-submit a request that application may be made to the Army Council for permission for The Manchester Regiment to use the Fleur de Lys as a Badge.
The application is forwarded by me on the authority and on behalf of the Colonel of the Regimaent, Major-General Sir Vere Fane, K.C.B., K.C.I.E., at present Commanding in Burmah.
A previews application was made in 1919 by the Colonel of the Regiment, supported by letters from the Officers Commanding both Regular Battalions, and was replied to by War Office Ietter No. 20/Infantry/1338 (Q.M.b.7) of 31st October 1919.
It is the unanimous wish of the Officers of both Regular Battalions of the Regiment that the Fleur de Lys should be authorised as one of the Badges of the Regiment.
Letters strongly approving of this application have been received from all the Honorary Colonels and Commanding Officers of the Militia and Territorial Battalions.
Further, a resolution of the Manchester City Council was unanimously adopted in August 1922, stating that the application was assented to by the City Council.

2. This request is not put forward on the grounds that the Fleur de Lys should be regarded in the light of a Battle Honour. It is forwarded for consideration on the
grounds of long usage, custom, and sentiment.

The arms of the City of Manchester as at present worn constitute a Badge of a non-military nature, and they are, moreover, worn at present by every worker in the employment of the City Corporation.

The Badge, therefore, as worn is by no means regarded by all ranks in the Regiment, who mainly come from Manchester, with those feelings which a Regimental Badge should inspire.

3. It is suggested that the Fleur de Lys should be worn as the Badge of the Regiment on the Headdress, and as the Collar Badge of the Service Dress Jacket of
Officers. The Badge of the 63d Foot would thus be retained and the Badge of the 96th Foot, The Sphinx, would remain on the Officers' buttons and the collar of the tunic; while the Territorial connection with the City of Manchester would be retained by the name of the Regiment.

4. A sample of the Fleur de Lys is enclosed.

I have the honour to be, Sir,
Your obedient Servant,
(Sgd.) F. H. DORLING,
Lt.-Colonel. Commanding 1st Battalion The Manchester Regiment.




COPY OF THE RESOLUTION OF THE MANCHESTER CITY COUNCIL



TOWN HALL, MANCHESTER,
3rd August, 1922.
SIR,
At the meeting of the City Council held on the 2nd instant I was requested to communicate to you the following resolution, which was unanimously adopted :

FLEUR DE LYS RESOLVED :

That inasmuch as it is represented to this Council that it is the desire of the Regular and Territorial Commanding Officers of The Manchester Regiment that the Officers and Men of such Regiment shall wear the Fleur de Lys as a Regimental Badge, and that an application in that behalf has or is about to be made to the War Office for authority so to do, and inasmuch as it is represented that if such authority be given, the word " Manchester " will appear on the shoulder straps of all ranks, and upon the buttons of the Officers' tunics, thereby further preserving the connection and association of the City with the Regiment, this Council in so far as it is concerned in such application assents thereto.
I shall be glad if you will submit this resolution to the Army Council.

I am, Sir,
Your obedient servant,
(Sgd.) P. M. HEATH,
Town Clerk.


The Secretary, War Office, London.
COPY OF WAR OFFICE LETTER SANCTIONING RESTORATION OF THE " FLEUR DE LYS " BADGE OF THE 63RD FOOT TO THE MANCHESTER REGIMENT.
WAR OFFICE, LONDON, S.W.I.
3st January, 1923. 20/Infantry/1570 (Q.M.G. 7).
SIR,
With reference to the attached copy of application of the Officer Commanding 1st Bn. The Manchester Regiment, I am commanded by the Army Council to inform you that approval is given for the Manchester Regiment to use the " Fleur de Lys " as a Clothing Badge in place of " The Arms of the City of Manchester."
The proposal that the " Fleur de Lys " should be worn as the headdress Badge for all ranks and as the Collar Badge on the Service Dress Jacket of Officers is sanctioned, on the understanding that no expense to the Public is thereby involved and that provision of the new cap badge for other ranks will not be proceeded with until stocks of the present pattern badge are exhausted.
I am to ask that a report may be furnished whether the enclosed sample " Fleur de Lys " (which was forwarded with the application of the 1st Battalion Manchester Regiment) is of the required design and size for the Service Dress Jackets of Officers, and that a sketch showing the exact dimensions of the cap badge may be forwarded to this Office in order that sealed patterns of the badges may be prepared. The enclosed sample badge should be returned with your reply.
I am to add that copies of this letter are being sent to the Colonel of The Manchester Regiment (Major-General Sir V. B. Fane, K.C.B., K.C.I.E.) ; to the Officers Commanding the 2nd Battalion and Depot of The Manchester Regiment, and to the Secretary, East Lancashire Territorial Force Association.
I am, Sir,
Your Obedient Servant,
(Sgd.) B. B. CUBBITT.
“It may be that your sole purpose in life is simply
  to serve as a warning to others."

daggers

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Re: Cap badge change from coat of arms to fleur de lys
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2008, 03:13:17 PM »
Thanks for that - it could not be clearer.
Daggers